Sea Eagles name squad for Sharks trial

1. DCE’s pay cheque of 1.5million / yr is destroying this once fine club.

2. $ 1.5 million. Haha.
   I’ve told you 1.5 million times,” don’t exaggerate “.
   There are few quality haves in the game atm.
   A decent one can nearly name his own price.

3. Decent. That ain’t back stabber DCE.

4. He isn’t on 1.5/year and besides he is the current Australian and qld half, I’d rather be paying his salary then ash Taylor over a mil and Mitch Moses 800k and Milford 1 mil without a doubt

5. How is it that Manly supporters know exactly what DCE’s on? Does the club disclose every player’s salary in memos or something?
   I don’t know what he’s on (either), except for what’s been reported, and media consensus at the time was $1.2 mil p.a over 8 years. That may have / may not have been in the form of $800k on the cap and $400k (allowable at the time) marque player allowance, but either way the marque allowance was rolled into the new cap format (the much higher/30man squad format), so it matters not.
   So maybe DCE’s deal was a very simple contract that was a flat annual wage, but I highly doubt it over an 8 year term. Maybe it didn’t start at $1.2 mil, but we all assumed it did, because it was reported as $10mil over 8 years. Maybe. I don’t know.
   In addition to the very widely reported $1.2 mil p.a and $10mil over 8 years, I know Gorman said, about a year ago, Manly’s top 5 players at the time were all on back ended deals, and I know DCE was pushing hard for the massive increase in the cap / player profit share, and I don’t think (which would indicate an opinion only) it was just because he’s a “good bloke” (pay rises for everyone except him). I also believe salary indexing is extremely common in mid/long term established player contracts, like DCE’s.
   Anyway, I’m not having a crack at Manly, or DCE for that matter, I’m just curious as to how some Manly supporters seem to know exactly what it’s not, and/or can (appear to) lowball what it is.

6. Same as all clubs, the supporters emerald know more as they are members or know people around the place.
   Also with Dce it’s not an 8 year contract it’s a 6 year contract with option for extra 2.
   Either way if he was in 1.5, he is still worth it compared to what clubs are payin for halves at the moment. As I said ash Taylor $1 mil, Moses $850, Corey Norman $800 even Ben hunt and Foran $1mil each.
   Even being a hater of manly you couldn’t argue with paying dce a little more then those players is fine. Do manly pay overs for dce??? Yep they do!!! But not 100’s of thousand $$$ more. Th market comparison is quite good actually…

7. “Either way if he was in 1.5, he is still worth it compared to what clubs are payin for halves at the moment. ”
   Maybe last year, but in all honesty I’d still say he was still on overs (significantly). I could make the counter arguememt to the players you listed and say something like but Brookes got the Dally M halfback, or Cronk on $1mil.
   But bottom line he needs to be the best half / best player in the comp to justify his salary, whatever it is. So on that basis have you got value for money over the past 3 years (on average)? That has to be a NO. I don’t think you can argue that, surely? Not even with “he’s the Qld and Aust. Half”, given that was 1 game for Qld, where he did play extremely well, and which led to the 2 games for Aust, where he was fair/marginal (at National rep level).
   Going forward, if he can hold those rep spots for the best part of the next 5 years at least, and pick up a Dally M or 2, then maybe you will be getting value for money. Personally I highly doubt it, although I think he may hold the Qld spot for another couple, but time will tell.

8. Hey Almighty,
   “How is it that manly fans know exactly how much DCE is on?”
   Click on menu- teams, scroll down.
   Very few salaries are posted, but Dce’s is.
   “Not having a crack”, but this is about the fifth time ive seen you make this argument.
   At one time I saw you “index” him up to $1.7 mill.

9. I wonder if the eels paid significant overs and got their moneys worth for such superb players like Hayne, Norman and moses, Foran and Watmough? Perhaps they may have for Hayne about 10 years ago.

10. Sandow

11. I think the prices on halves will always be high because they lead the team if you don’t have a good one you don’t have a chance. More often than not you need two good halves. With that said a player can say he wants a deal for 1 mill (ie Ash Taylor) and even if he isn’t worth it at the moment (which he isn’t) then it puts pressure on his current club to either pay him that amount or look for another player because someone will be willing to pay that for him. I’d personally say Ash is worth 700k but you must count he’s young and will get better and that he’s the main playmaker on a team which doesn’t have a halve no where near as good. I think paying him an extra 300k is really not that bad when you consider what he brings and what he could do at other clubs. For DCE he’s not worth 1.5, I’d say he’s worth 1 mill but for me 500k extra is to much. Don’t think any other club would’ve signed him on that much or for that long. For 1.5 you could almost get Norman 800k and Taylor 1 mill. This would give you two halves both good, 1 who will play make and 1 who will run and they both can kick well. Havinb DCE on so much coin has forced the club to look for a cheap partner for him (ie Hodkinson and Elgey) who can’t demand big money as they aren’t match winners and has stopped Manly being so successful.

12. That player salary list isn’t accurate, usually isn’t anyway, unless a players salary is rereported (reported annually) which is rare.
    I’ve seen numerous salaries still listed at the “starting rate”, when I know they’ve changed/increased.
    As per my post above, I don’t know what DCE’s on, nor am I claiming to, but I’m assuming, based on probabilities, it’s much higher than $1.2 mil (now), and yes, IF it had full cap indexing built in, and IF it started at $1.2 mil, then it would be up around $1.7 mil.
    I’ve never claimed it is $1.5 or $1.7, or any other number, but I suspect, again based on probabilities, it’s up around there.
    I actually don’t care what it is, but yes, I’ve been known, on numerous occasions to post what I think it is/what it probably is, when people post lowball numbers as “fact” and/or when they post trying to “shoot down” a fair estimate, and by “shoot it down”, state as if it’s a fact, “he’s not on that”, as has been the case re Kelby’s estimate above.
    As for Parra paying overs, I think you’d find dozens, at the very least, of comments from me saying that we have a very poor track record for doing just that. We do, FACT, or at least I think it is, and when I think we are/have paid overs, I’ll say so.
    When we were found to have cheated the salary cap, I’ve posted “we cheated the cap”, “we deserved our punishment”, “we can’t talk” etc etc, also on dozens of occasions, because we did, FACT. Sometimes, as much as we don’t like it, our clubs (any supporters club) makes mistakes, and just because you support the club you shouldn’t try and pretend otherwise, like “but Manly’s was an admin error” etc.

13. The manly team being what it is has nothing to do with how much DCE is on but rather what happened with the back ended contracts of players like Snake and Matai rumoured to be around $1mil each in their last year and neither played much due to injury. They then had to top up contracts to the Turbo brothers and Kapow and bringing Thommo over from the Dragons. When they got on top of that they were then hit with a salary cap penalty which buggered them last year and this year. They have turned over more players in the last three years than any other club and it has cost them money but they needed the cleanout. I think they have something to build on now but it will take them another few years before they can spend on the open market for some good backs and benchie front rows. We just have to stop Des and his penchant for back ended deals which killed Manly when he left and he did the same with the Dogs where you had players like Eastwood earning near a mill for playing with Newtown. Every team has someone on equivalent money to DCE but still manage to build a team and i think DCE is worth the $$$. If his stats are anything to go by he leads the other halves considerably. He doesn’t need something like the Daly M to prove his worth. FYI the Daly M voting system is rubbish. BJ Leliua won best centre for FFS

14. Almighty
    You can twist your own reality as much as you want, but the facts are-

    Parra- $1 million fine, 12 comp points, the deregistration of five former board officials, as well as the stripping of the club’s 2016 Auckland Nines title – which will cost the club a further $370,000 in prize money.

    Manly- $500 000 fine $330 000 for 2 years off salary cap. Not really comparable.

    “The player list ins’t accurate” Only when convenient to you.

    Just like Shakira’s hips, the data doesn’t lie

15. We were stripped of the 9’s trophy, and prize money, because that’s what we won during the period we were over the cap. If Manly had of won something during their 5 year period of cheating, then they too would have albut certainly lost it. Maybe not a “fact”, because you didn’t win anything, so it can’t be proven, but a very high probability. Yeah, are you getting the hang of this?
    We were stripped of ALL competition points earned during the season, whilst, and because, we earned them whilst being over the salary cap. Sounds fair to me, even as a Parra supporter. Manly were found guilty during the off season, and got under the cap for the start of last season, hence no points to lose. If they were found guilty part way through a season, and if they had any points at that stage, then its extremely likely they would have lost points too. Again it’s not a fact, because you didn’t have points, but it’s a very high probability, very close to 100% would be my guess.
    Yes, we got a bigger fine for our cheating, but you also got a big fine, and were stripped of future cap space, we weren’t. We weren’t because we wore it during the season, and you were because you didn’t.
    Did we cheat worse than Manly? Probably, the size of our penalty would indicate that, but was Manly’s an “admin error”? Not likely.
    As for the DCE arguememt, his pay was, and still is, listed as it was when it started, so as per the explanations above, I don’t believe it would remain unchanged for 8 years, but here we go again, that’s based on probabilities only.

16. As I have said before there are different levels of not complying with the cap. Parra’s handing out of ca$h in brown paperbags in car parks was accompanied by issuing false invoices to cover up their trail. They are Just as bad as the storm creating multiple sets of books. Thats the difference between eels and manly eelsalmighty.

17. A lot of hypotheticals and assumptions there, almighty.
    If manlys infringements were serious enough they would have been made to start with negative points.

18. They were seriously enough to be docked salary cap for 2 years, and I could argue ours weren’t, based purely on the fact we didn’t, but we all know that’s a massively flawed arguememt.
    So, “A lot of hypotheticals and assumptions”, of course, but both clubs breached. I accept ours was deliberate, and I accept our punishment, and actually believe it was fair.
    I don’t believe Manly’s breaches, so many and over so many years, could be just “admin errors”, but the proven “breaches” were a lesser amount than Parra’s, so I think a lesser penalty is probably reasonable.

    Perhaps we should simply agree to disagree.

19. Eels,
    We certainly won’t go on dally m half because we’ll thats just ridiculous and everyone knows that.
    And also please don’t tell me your actually believing Cronk is only on a mil????
    As I said we prob do pay a little overs for dce, but in comparisons to the players I mentioned and lots more it’s not anywhere near as much overs as people go on with is all I’m saying…
    Also as I said it’s not 8 year contract and not on the money some people like to say…
    He as of now is the best half in the Como and that is why he won qld that origin game and will continue to be the aus half for another couple years

20. That’s a fair enough point re the Dally M, but the point was he has to be the best, and by a fair distance to justify the coin he’s on.
    Yes, I do believe Cronk is on a $1mil. That would seem like a fair price, that’s what was reported, and it’s a 2 year deal (no/very little indexing on a 2 year deal). I like how you can question that, yet don’t think DCE’s deal could be indexed.
    As per my comment above, you could argue you got your monies worth last year, although I think it was still overs, the 2 years prior have to be a NO (to having got your monies worth) and going forward, we don’t know, but I’d still be surprised if he can live up to his price tag.
    P.S, your comments remind me of someone Bob, someone that used to post on this site, who was also a Manly supporter.

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